Author Topic: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window  (Read 20252 times)

keets

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #15 on: December 29, 2014, 06:02:15 AM »


The two symbols on the right are both symbols I found that represent Artemis.  The image on the left is what Dyson pieced together of the photographs of the brands from each sacrifice in the case he and Vex were investigating.

On the re-watch, the hunter was never shown with a bow, only a knife.

I guess Atemis will be the new big bad ushering in Bo's Dad for the finale.  I think you're right Dani, Bo will get her act together in later episodes.  Maybe she will figure out to snuff out the candle? One can hope.

p.s. also, Persephone's warning to Bo about what to eat, and what not to eat in Tarterus has all kinds of new meanings to me. The warning came too late to Bo.  She has already "fed" off of Persephone before she got that warning. Trap!
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 06:12:00 AM by keets »
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SL3

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #16 on: December 29, 2014, 07:13:33 AM »
lol keds loving the muppets. All the recaps here are so much more entertaining than the show.

Oh the show. It feels like I am watching a whole different series. Its like they have reset the whole thing without telling us & we are back to the start but this time they are going to do it more in line with JFs original sexy succubus premise. She's good, she's bad, she's bi.  The madcap tales of a sex addict and her entourage of friends with benefits, fighting fae & saving the world. If it had been like this from the start I wouldn't have lasted long at all. It all seems so shallow and emotionless. It is such a shame coming from a show that once inspired such passion.

So to this week's ep - I've hidden Doccubus away in a safe place in my heart - que sera sera - & tried to watch this as just a fun sexy show.
- uh OK so there is lots of sex, but most of it was offscreened, and none of it was fun
- in fact I think they have offscreened all the hetro sex this season? Odd.
- this Mark kid & giving him Bo's old story line seems so unnecessary
- I got bored & must have missed why there were blood drained bodies in Lauren's lab so that plotline went over my head, but hey its just a fun sexy show so no worries
- how many times this season are they going to make Lauren watch/interrupt/listen to Bo making out with someone else? This is growing old real fast.
- The episode is called When God Opens a Window - so what is the closed door? DyBo?
- at the IO panel AS said this season was "magical". That was just as they were filming episode 6. We are up to episode 4. I don't see anything magical so far.

nic

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #17 on: December 29, 2014, 07:50:12 AM »


The two symbols on the right are both symbols I found that represent Artemis.  The image on the left is what Dyson pieced together of the photographs of the brands from each sacrifice in the case he and Vex were investigating.

On the re-watch, the hunter was never shown with a bow, only a knife.

I guess Atemis will be the new big bad ushering in Bo's Dad for the finale.  I think you're right Dani, Bo will get her act together in later episodes.  Maybe she will figure out to snuff out the candle? One can hope.

p.s. also, Persephone's warning to Bo about what to eat, and what not to eat in Tarterus has all kinds of new meanings to me. The warning came too late to Bo.  She has already "fed" off of Persephone before she got that warning. Trap!

Great catch keets!...  In this context yes the use of bow becomes quite intriguing.

Just a note about Mark age that has been also discussed: the concensus seems he  is 17 in human terms? I would like  to remind everyone, but especially our American friends, that legal age of consent  in Canada and in many countries is 16....there are some exceptions applying for authority figures, but it's the basic rule. So I would not  call Bo having sex with Mark anything remotely close to pedophilia.

But of course I would do something very, very illegal to any 30 y old that would dare to even kiss my teens...
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 08:05:46 AM by nic »

SL3

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #18 on: December 29, 2014, 08:18:44 AM »


The two symbols on the right are both symbols I found that represent Artemis.  The image on the left is what Dyson pieced together of the photographs of the brands from each sacrifice in the case he and Vex were investigating.

On the re-watch, the hunter was never shown with a bow, only a knife.

I guess Atemis will be the new big bad ushering in Bo's Dad for the finale.  I think you're right Dani, Bo will get her act together in later episodes.  Maybe she will figure out to snuff out the candle? One can hope.

p.s. also, Persephone's warning to Bo about what to eat, and what not to eat in Tarterus has all kinds of new meanings to me. The warning came too late to Bo.  She has already "fed" off of Persephone before she got that warning. Trap!

Great catch keets!...  In this context yes the use of bow becomes quite intriguing.

Just a note about Mark age that has been also discussed: the concensus seems he  is 17 in human terms? I would like  to remind everyone, but especially our American friends, that legal age of consent  in Canada and in many countries is 16....there are some exceptions applying for authority figures, but it's the basic rule. So I would not  call Bo having sex with Mark anything remotely close to pedophilia.

But of course I would do something very, very illegal to any 30 y old that would dare to even kiss my teens...

In the enhanced Showcase version when they first show him on the bus they go out of their way to state his age by adding a caption with a script quote "A well built young fae (19)". They must have sensed trouble  ::)

Keets love the candle affecting all the fae idea. Hope that is true!

keds

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #19 on: December 29, 2014, 09:26:32 AM »
Keets, totally-- Artemis.  How unfortunate that they seem to be making her into a herald of death instead of the goddess of the hunt and protector she was always associated with.  And I agree, Dyson murdering the Hunter speaks of darkness.  And anyone calling that less than murder, when Vex literally held the man's hands back and disarmed him, is a waste of society space.  It was also disgusting when Bo carries Dyson's face in her hands with blood and guts all over them from dead guy and says NOTHING about it.

I do think doccubus will be the saving grace of this show, at least that is the hope.  Bo's unfettered lingering glances and the intense purpose with which they are making Lauren emo suffer are too much there to be an accident.  It's just hard to believe that after 17 episodes from Taft, they still haven't had a conversation about anything involving just them for longer than 45seconds.  As a storyteller, if you want to make something more emotionally impactful, shouldn't you give it glimpses of the day?  Because the impacts they are spending the time with involve Dyson, Dyson's son, and Tamsin's less than platonic heal Not!Sex kisses.  When the lesser of the three get time to emote episodes on end....it just doesn't make sense.

I still have a difficult time swallowing Bo's predilection to screw everything as the answer.  Mark was talking about his suffering, and all she could think about doing was shagging him to make it all better because "connection?"  He's a kid, telling you his sad life story, and crying about it, and a woman 20 years older is just going to fuck it all away?  I still think it smacks of indecency, no matter how hard they try to pretty the underage up with 19yr old one liners.  Of course, Dyson is the biggest cradle robber of them all, but...consenting 1000yr old babies and all.

The biggest problem still is Bo.  Lauren is doing just fine on her own, but they've removed all emotional ties to her--> she's the offscreen tech when you need her.  Bo is NOT yet clearheaded.  It's like all of those statements about Bo's new direction were for the 1st episode only.  The protagonist remains unlikable, fighting for her one biological instinct, screwing whomever she wants whenver she wants, and is truly a 180 from Bo's intentions in season 1. 

I don't even remember the premise of the show because it's been buried in a quagmire so deep, I'm sure it will take several more rape jokes to make it right.  They deal with sexuality, and coercive power for fucks sake?  Could they treat it with the gravitas and decency it deserves while saving consenting ADULT relationships for the funny stuff? 
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 09:31:03 AM by keds »

nic

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2014, 10:57:57 AM »
Maybe one of the purpose of Bo sleeping with Mark is to show that embracing her nature in what looks like just fun sometimes have consequences?

On the other hand, Tamsing being  a full fae ass , especially her looking at Lauren implying "you're out and I'm in", makes sense. But there is a continuity problem with last week. Again.  For Dyson, they tried to make it look like the hunter crossed a line attacking his family but still...

I get from this episode that the faes are full faes, even Evony (remembering that being fae is also cultural), and it's not pretty.

Btw Evony trapping Lauren this way was quite clever....Because our good doctor value too much life to go for the easy way out, ie finding a way to quickly kill the creature.  But maybe I did not understand the scene correctly?

Keets on second thought, maybe I didn't pay attention enough but the hunter didn't deny being responsible for Bo's injury. How could this fit? But it doesn't change the fact that the Artemis symbol is a huge clue.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 02:41:21 PM by nic »

ZPLover

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #21 on: December 29, 2014, 12:14:25 PM »



Can I just say YAY!  :(w00t)  The lab coat is back!!

keds

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #22 on: December 29, 2014, 12:58:22 PM »
Here's EV's Starry Mag Interview.  I like her charity work, and I wish they had allowed some of these side characters to grow beyond their tantrum stereotypes, but alas.

http://starrymag.com/?p=5086

You get the feel that she missed Vex because he was off with Dyson and Tamsin all season.  She seems to have only worked much with ZP this year. 

The Wanderer

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #23 on: December 29, 2014, 01:06:57 PM »
So Mark boy is 19. I guess every shapeshifter gain their shape shifting ability gradually. By the age of 16 they hit Fae puberty and get the initial power but can't fully shape shifting yet. That's Dyson's role in Mark's life, to train him.

Doccubus. The show have lost its depth and consistency. In s4 finale, Bo decided to wear the necklace and Lauren confessed "I'm yours" to Bo, followed up by a kiss initiated by Bo. Then in s5 they suddenly became just friends without any explanation. I can understand that in the first episode Bo was busy saving Kenzi. But until now I can't really feel the romantic gestures from Bo to Lauren (Bo even had some with Dyson - hands holding, cheek caressing, the offscreened sex). Lauren is longing for Bo, I have no doubt, but the sparks Bo had for Lauren just gone, there were some tender gazing from Bo but not too passionate. And the meaning of the FTL necklace this season is just a necklace, nothing more, esp. Bo rarely wears it now and she didn't even realized when it's gone in Valhalla. The writers tried to convince us that Lauren holds a special place in Bo's heart, but only via Stacy's mouth.

Kenzi. For the first time I wish Kenzi is back. Tamsin can't make a good BFF for Bo. Even though Kenzi is Team Dyson and she sometimes annoys Lauren, but she's not a jerk with personality problem like Tamsin. And most important, Kenzi is human.

keds

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #24 on: December 29, 2014, 01:35:36 PM »
The issue really is centering.  With Kenzi gone, and Lauren not having any emotional contact with Bo, the protagonist is surrounded by the fae world in its entirety.  There's no mortal push there to drive a stronger purpose in her.

What was grating about Shaw's exec, Finney, trying to misdirect the feedback from last night's episode, is that Bo has ALWAYS been a succubus.  She has never stopped being one, but in S1 and S2 she had an emotional center, rooted in compassion and humanity.  Since S3, Bo has been nothing but a confused, self-seeking, disengaged fae-- borderline abusive to the people that have professed their love of her time and again.  This isn't about the audience not getting who Bo is, it's because the show has drastically changed characterizations and in doing so, made it difficult to identify or care for Bo.  The center of the show is lost. 

What makes this a hot ticket, quick temper flareup, is that they deal with sexuality and the power of coercion.  If the hero of the show no longer understands how she is hurting the people around her, how can we cheer for that?  Sex for sex sake does not sex positivity make, especially in the distasteful family and child sexuality they keep pressing into and engaging in.  There needs to be something better she is fighting for, and with only 12 episodes left they have a lot of work to do to make any of her journey feel meaningful again.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 01:37:14 PM by keds »

nic

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #25 on: December 29, 2014, 02:27:24 PM »
Just a side note: the Bo - Jr sex was also a huge nod to the male audience, sex with an older hot woman- sex goddess  being maybe  the number one phantasm of most young guys.
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 02:42:56 PM by nic »

lysangelle

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #26 on: December 29, 2014, 03:45:59 PM »
First: General thoughts on the season til this last ep. I must say I liked it (with the  occasional cringe that came to be a part of watching LG)

Admitedly I like 'big in Japan' because of Lauren storyline.

It seems like Zoie is going to inherit most of Kenzi's one liners and funny moments and I can't be happier, I love her comedic talent and hope they'll keep using it from time to time.
Some might debate that Tamsin got the funny repartees but it doesn't work for me. it feels to me it's just transferring Kenzi into Tamsin: she's the repacement roommate, replacement partner on cases, replacement 'let's try to make Lauren ill at ease and unwelcome' tool and BFF wannabe (minus the platonic aspect) It's all too easy an out for me. Especially since she is NO Ksenia Solo)

Last ep is the first of the season leaving me frustrated (And no, not only because of themuch more limited Zoie's screentime!)
For the first time I really had a problem with one of the show sexual situation. I generally don't react badly at most of the things that get others uneasy or even mad: my point of view is for one that Bo is a succubus, no sex is 'wrong' sex for her. Also, it's a Fae world and Fae don't need to have the same morals than humans, it's one of the things the genre allows.

Still, the Bo/Mark sex was very unwelcome in my book. Now we know that Mark is supposed to be 19 (conveniently mentionned on  the enhanced video of the ep) but then we're supposed to think he reached that age and never shifted yet? That just doesn't fit for me. Call that one the mother of belated puberty!

That said, now that I made my peace with the whole thing I see a good side at that storyline. Now Bo has slept with Dyson's son and wants to keep it hidden from him. We know how well that usually goes. It's the opportunity for a huge wedge to develop between Bo and Dyson and hooooopefully put an end to the tender 'no strings' looks and gestures between them. I had hoped after the finale of last season that that relationship had been given clearer guidelines (it wasmy first cringe of the season)

The downside of Dyson having a son; probable even more screentime for him as that  storyline develop. Like He needs anymore of it!

I'm wondering where they're going with Doccubus. Last time we see them in the finale Lauren was admitting  she was all Bo's and they kissed.
So far this season, they look like the most physically distant of all of the big mix of relationships of the show. They throw us some bones (like tracy saying that Lauren hold a special place in Bo's heart) who usually get me snorting and yelling at the tv; ("Oh Yeah? Prove it! We want proofs, preferably of the naked kind!)
Some flirting with a new bunch of cockblocking people or situations? What is this? Season 1?

To finish; one prayer to the docubus goddess; can they pleeease stop making Lauren have to listen/witness Bo having sex with others? Is that really too much to ask?!?!?!

 :( ooops sorry got a bit carried away there  :(blush)

ZPLover

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #27 on: December 29, 2014, 05:19:34 PM »
Well ya know.. Bo will be Bo.

Not directing my thots to any one in particular.. just the forum as a whole.

But I don't get the slut-shamming of Bo.. She is a Succubus ya know.. of course you do.

Sex with random ppl is what she does to survive.. and it's nothing new.. they're just showing it a lot more this year.  She's been doing it all along.. they just haven't shown it every time. And the young guy doesn't bother me either.. it happened in S2(?).. when she told Lauren 'I wanted to keep the kid alive'. It was also S2 Bo who had a 3some with Ryan & the waitress. Gratuitous sex is nothing new for this character. Yet S5 Bo is considered an asshat.

EO's just mad that she doesn't commit herself to Lauren.. but even if she did.. it's already been established that she would still have to feed from others. So who should these others be. EO's mad when she feeds from Dyson or Tamsin.. and EO's mad when she feeds from random ppl who she has no feelings for.. It's a 'no win' thing.. I don't get it.  :-\ 

Also you can tell that Bo doesn't like it that Lauren is present whenever Tamsin jumps her.. Lauren tries to act like it doesn't bother her.. but the angst will lead to good things later.  :(thumb)

Lexi

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #28 on: December 29, 2014, 05:37:06 PM »
The issue really is centering.  With Kenzi gone, and Lauren not having any emotional contact with Bo, the protagonist is surrounded by the fae world in its entirety.  There's no mortal push there to drive a stronger purpose in her.

What was grating about Shaw's exec, Finney, trying to misdirect the feedback from last night's episode, is that Bo has ALWAYS been a succubus.  She has never stopped being one, but in S1 and S2 she had an emotional center, rooted in compassion and humanity.  Since S3, Bo has been nothing but a confused, self-seeking, disengaged fae-- borderline abusive to the people that have professed their love of her time and again.  This isn't about the audience not getting who Bo is, it's because the show has drastically changed characterizations and in doing so, made it difficult to identify or care for Bo.  The center of the show is lost. 

What makes this a hot ticket, quick temper flareup, is that they deal with sexuality and the power of coercion.  If the hero of the show no longer understands how she is hurting the people around her, how can we cheer for that?  Sex for sex sake does not sex positivity make, especially in the distasteful family and child sexuality they keep pressing into and engaging in.  There needs to be something better she is fighting for, and with only 12 episodes left they have a lot of work to do to make any of her journey feel meaningful again.

I agree with you Keds I believe that they are trying to show that without Kenzi Bo has gone back to being the same Lost Girl that she was in season 1, and without the humans being close to Bo anymore and surrounded by nothing but Fae its starting to make her become more of one than she ever was before.

The funny thing about everything is that Shaw proucers and the show producers are trying to use that Bo is a succubus and that she has always been one. They fail to realize that we know this we know that she's succubus we know that she has to feed to survive we know all this we also know that she can't monogamous, but she can be emotionally. They also forgot that the creator said that Bo can monogamous if she wants as well. We told them that the majorly of the audience were Doccubus fans, but they didn't believe us now look what's happening the show is getting so much backlash and negative remarks they are trying to defuse the situation with using Bo is a succubus and she always has been. Nobody can relate Bo everyone hates how she treats Lauren and the ones she claims she loves we don't know her anymore we can't feel sorry for her, or feel anything for her. MG said same thing in an interview she's a succubus and has always been one  that's an excuse that no longer works for anyone anymore.

I believe that without Doccubus and Benzi the show is truly lost. The two most meaning and powerful relationships are no longer important anymore and the show is suffering badly without these two. Instead we have an arrogant and selfish Bo who acts more Fae than humanity anymore. Fans are making their voices heard and are greatly showing their displeasure with the show, and Shaw producers and Lost Girl producers have no idea what to do and say except she's a succubus. They are feeling the wrath of the Doccubus Army as well as the Benzi Army as well. Instead they gave Dybo and Valkubus and the show is suffering greatly and the feed back is more negative than ever.

The problem they fail to see with this episode is the sex she had with a teenager although now they are saying he's 19 still its was sex with a teenager and Dyson's son no less, and she wants to keep a secret when she was hard on Lauren about her lies in season 1, and how much she hates lies now she's doing another reason to hate her character even more. And she is always having in front of Lauren as well as she hears it. Is it too much to ask to not have Lauren a witness to this as well as, have a convo between the two is that too much to ask for. If they continue to give Dybo and Valkubus as well as Dyson Jr. then all hope for this show is gone its only saving grace to me is Doccubus as well as Benzi to me.

Oh and a friend told me the reason why twitter messed up was not due to Dyson Jr and Degrassi people if any watched it messed up because fans were tweeting to the show about how much they hated the sex between Bo and Dyson Jr and the way Lauren is being treated, that's what messed up twitter last night.

keds

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Re: Episode Discussion S5:E4--When God Opens a Window
« Reply #29 on: December 29, 2014, 05:45:35 PM »
Well ya know.. Bo will be Bo.

Not directing my thots to any one in particular.. just the forum as a whole.

But I don't get the slut-shamming of Bo.. She is a Succubus ya know.. of course you do.

Sex with random ppl is what she does to survive.. and it's nothing new.. they're just showing it a lot more this year.  She's been doing it all along.. they just haven't shown it every time. And the young guy doesn't bother me either.. it happened in S2(?).. when she told Lauren 'I wanted to keep the kid alive'. It was also S2 Bo who had a 3some with Ryan & the waitress. Gratuitous sex is nothing new for this character. Yet S5 Bo is considered an asshat.

EO's just mad that she doesn't commit herself to Lauren.. but even if she did.. it's already been established that she would still have to feed from others. So who should these others be. EO's mad when she feeds from Dyson or Tamsin.. and EO's mad when she feeds from random ppl who she has no feelings for.. It's a 'no win' thing.. I don't get it.  :-\ 

Also you can tell that Bo doesn't like it that Lauren is present whenever Tamsin jumps her.. Lauren tries to act like it doesn't bother her.. but the angst will lead to good things later.  :(thumb)

Oh, I'm sure you're not ZPLover.  I'm sure it's just directed to EO, whomever that may be.

You might have missed 1/2 the posts on this thread already, so I'll recap.  No one is slut shaming Bo, I'm not sure where people get this from in conversation.  Bo is a succubus, Bo was a succubus in S1 and S2 and all of us... ALL OF US cheered for her because she had her humanity and her compassion intact while still boinking Lauren, Ryan, Dyson, and threesomes.   This Bo is a nihilistic narcissistic version and it's been playing for way too long.   There is a mile of difference between the two.  One had a care for what was going on around her and her lovers, the other does not. You do not go for five years on a show that talks about choice being #1, developing deep fractured relationships with the other characters, only to end the run with biology dictates everything and having hollowed out non-conversations with one of two previous lovers.

Treating sex for sex sake, as the only justification for positive representation seems wide of the mark.  Clear headed Bo, doesn't seem clear headed when she cannot resist the wiles of crying teen on her bed.  Tamsin treats her bed partner like an object, and Bo uses that object with dubious consent.   Dyson just murdered a dude, and we are supposed to feel sorry for him.   I've grown tired of the message this show is marketing, and I do judge its complete lack of self awareness in regards to what a minefield they hold.   You'll have to excuse my opinion as an old stick in the mud who desires concrete characterizations that demonstrate growth instead of regression.   Lauren seems to be the only grown up left, and for what it's worth...that's seriously sad.   
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 05:49:39 PM by keds »